Hey so I just found out that 168 kanji had their stroke order change in 2004. Did not know that… - Feed Post by shirokitsune

• 
  wigglysquire

  ah yea I've already encountered some difficulties with that since the first book I was using was a bit old and I was too lazy to go out and buy the newer version for while.

  January 18, 2017 at 12:00pm
• 
  mog86uk

  I think the standardised form of the kanji is what was changed, rather than specifically the stroke order. Although I understand that having strokes added/removed/changed has an effect on stroke order. Characters were changed from previous JIS standards in 1990 and 1983 too.
  
  Of those 168 characters that in 2004 had their appearance changed, none of them were 常用 kanji at the time.
  
  Even among the 196 kanji that have since been added to the 常用 list (in 2010), only 23 of these seem to be among those 168 changed kanji.
  
  So, now, of the 2,136 kanji in the current version of the 常用 kanji list, only 23 are ones that had their form changed back in 2004. (If I counted correctly anyway..) ^^

  January 19, 2017 at 6:15am
• 
  shirokitsune

  Thanks for the clarification mog! The problem that I am running into is while the 常用 list is useful for beginners and intermediates there is also the 人名用 for names to consider. Also when you reach advanced levels of Japanese (N1+) there are tons of Kanji used in specific situations (mainly science in my experience). By the way, I am in no way beyond the N1. When it comes to grammar I am only around N2 or even possibly the N3. But, when I take practice tests I can easily pass the vocabulary, Kanji, and listening sections of the N2. Also I tend to pass N1 practice tests for the same 3 sections but not 100 percent.

  January 19, 2017 at 8:32am
• 
  mog86uk

  212 of the 862 人名用 kanji are simply 旧字体 forms of 常用 kanji anyway.
  
  http://www.moj.go.jp/content/001131003.pdf
  ↑The current official publication of the 人名用 list. ^^
  
  http://mindtwisted.com/
  ↑I like the app "Kanji Study" on Android. It has 6,383 kanji. You study lists of kanji as either flashcards, multiple-choice quizzes, or kanji drawing challenge. It has per-made lists of 常用 and 人名用 kanji or of JLPT levels. And I've made custom lists of the 815 kanji in JCJP kanji lessons, the 1,360 kanji in JCJP practice encounters, the 1,972 kanji in Slime Forest, the 191 常用 kanji missing from Slime Forest, etc.
  
  I made a list containing all 6,383 kanji. About a year ago I went through the entire thing using the flashcard study feature... Supposedly, by my ratings system: I "know" 1,600 well (know both the meaning and at least one reading); I am "familiar" with an additional 690 kanji (know either a meaning or a reading, or otherwise am to some extent familiar with both); and I "seen" a further 580 kanji (have a vague idea of either a meaning or reading).
  
  I tried to investigate whether the app has all 862 人名用 kanji though, and found by my calculations that 103 of them are missing. This is due to the app only having kanji for which there exist SVG files made by the KanjiVG project (http://kanjivg.tagaini.net). Bit of a shame with how close to having all 2,998 常用+人名用 kanji. ^^;

  January 20, 2017 at 7:32am
• 
  shirokitsune

  6,383 kanji? I have a list that I am currently using for a project similar to slime forest, but it only has 6355 kanji. Those are all the Kanji that the KanKen test up to level 1. From what I understood those are the only kanji that typical computers can produce without a separate file source. I wonder what those extra kanji are.

  January 20, 2017 at 8:35am
• 
  mog86uk

  Those 6355 kanji are the kanji in "JIS X 0208" encoding. I think that app I mentioned contains every kanji in that encoding, plus a few extras. If I remember correctly, those 103 人名用 kanji I mentioned about not being in the app are also not in JIS X 0208 encoding. I think these can all be found in JIS X 0212 encoding, but it's been a while since I looked into it all... ^^;

  January 20, 2017 at 8:42am
• 
  shirokitsune

  Wow... I guess I need to revisit my list and add more kanji haha

  January 20, 2017 at 11:28am
• 
  mog86uk

  Bleh. Didn't mean to refer to them as "encodings" multiple times in my post, when they are simply character sets used by encodings... Like, for example, JIS X 0213 character set is used by Shift_JISX0213 encoding.
  
  Anyway, I found my calculation experiment spreadsheets for the different character sets. Found out what the stats...
  
  JIS X 0208 = 6,355 kanji (757 of these are 人名用)
  JIS X 0212 = 5,081 other kanji (14 of these are 人名用)
  
  So the two character sets combined = 12,156 kanji, of which 769 are 人名用. This means 93 of the 862 人名用 kanji aren't even in these two char sets put together. (Also, 2 of the 196 kanji that entered the 常用漢字表 in 2010 aren't even in JIS X 0208, even though all the other 2,134 常用 kanji are... However, those two kanji are found in the JIS X 0212 character set.)
  
  JIS X 0213 = 10,050 kanji. This is an extension of JIS X 0208, containing all 6,355 kanji from it. It also uses 2,743 of the 5,081 kanji from JIS X 0212, which contains the 2 常用 kanji and 14 人名用 kanji. And on top of that it adds an extra 952 kanji that were not in either set, which contains all the remaining 91 人名用 kanji. So this character set has all 2,136 常用 kanji and 862 人名用 kanji.
  
  ... Yeah... I got way too interested in this again... ^^;

  January 20, 2017 at 2:08pm
• 
  mog86uk

  But, if the "6,355 kanji" figure that is stated as being the amount of kanji in the Kanken level is really just the same kanji as in the JIS X 0208 character set...
  
  Then that would mean the highest level of Kanken lacks 2 常用 kanji and 105 人名用 kanji! Even though on those same sites that say that they also say Kanken tests all 常用 and 人名用 kanji for the lower levels, lol. XD

  January 20, 2017 at 2:13pm